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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 11:10 am 
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It's a harsh decision, McDermott worked wonders to get them promoted and the owners didn't back him with the funds to strengthen the squad enough. Also doesn't make any sense with 9 games left, what is a new manager meant to change in that short a time with the transfer window closed.

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idontfeardeath wrote:
Spawny wrote:
But James and Pak both said they were voting JSP


:doh:

You know what Paks like. He's probably voted JSP for woman of the year or something.


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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 11:25 am 
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Di Canio has proven nothing he had a big budget at Swindon and did well with it just like Ince did when he had money at MK Dons what track record has he got of getting a team of underdogs to punch above their weight.

McDermott for me did a good job he got them promoted and they're in touch with with the pack although results have started to swing against them again.


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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 12:16 am 
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Reading are set to appoint Nigel Adkins as their new manager just two months after he was sacked by fellow Premier League strugglers Southampton, ESPN understands.

Adkins led Saints to back-to-back promotions as they returned to the top flight after a seven-year absence last May but he was axed in January, with Mauricio Pochettino taking his place in the St Mary's hotseat in a move that was widely condemned.

But the former Scunthorpe United boss is now set for a second crack at Premier League management after agreeing to join Reading, who parted company with Brian McDermott two weeks ago.

The Royals' move to appoint Adkins as manager will be popular among the club's supporters, who had identified him among their favourites to succeed McDermott at the Madejski Stadium.

However, Adkins is clearly second choice for the Berkshire club after their attempts to hire Brighton boss Guy Poyet fell through last week and he faces a race against time to revive a flagging Royals.

Adkins faces a tough task to keep Reading in the Premier League as they currently sit one place off the foot of the table eight games from the end of the season, with Adkins set for a baptism of fire in his first two games in charge.

Next weekend's daunting trip to face a revived Arsenal at Emirates Stadium will be a prelude to a reunion with his former Southampton players in what is set to be his first home game in charge of Reading on April 6.

Bookmakers give Adkins little hope of saving Reading from the drop, with the Royals listed by most as favourites for relegation after losing their last six games in all competitions.


Good appointment imo he did well getting Southampton in the Prem and probably deserved the full season.

The reality is his job if he takes it will be to get them back up next season


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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 10:10 am 
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Totally agree JSP. The end of this season is just a bedding in period really, the odds of them staying up are remote at best.

Glad to see Adkins back in football though, thought he was really harshly treated by Southampton when he was doing a good job.

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idontfeardeath wrote:
Spawny wrote:
But James and Pak both said they were voting JSP


:doh:

You know what Paks like. He's probably voted JSP for woman of the year or something.


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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 11:15 am 
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You can make a case that if the owners didn't rate McDermott they should have been ruthless like Southampton by hanging on to the manager because they won a few games it meant when the run came to an end they were stuffed. For me they should have stuck with McDermott until at least the end of the season then made a decision being a promoted side who only came up because they hit form at the perfect time last season and then not really spending much money was it really a surprise they've gone back down?

Adkins should be able to pick them up and get them going again next season his knowledge of the lower leagues means with the owners money and parachute payments they'll be a strong contender in the Championship next season although if 'Arry stays at QPR you have to fancy them to walk it next season


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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 11:56 am 
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To me if you get a team promoted then you've earned the right to another season, don't like all this chopping and changing where promoted clubs get rid so soon. Adkins in particular was doing quite a good job when he was sacked, and his replacement really hasn't improved things.

Getting shot of a manager at this point is particularly baffling.

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idontfeardeath wrote:
Spawny wrote:
But James and Pak both said they were voting JSP


:doh:

You know what Paks like. He's probably voted JSP for woman of the year or something.


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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 12:14 pm 
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Spawny wrote:
To me if you get a team promoted then you've earned the right to another season, don't like all this chopping and changing where promoted clubs get rid so soon. Adkins in particular was doing quite a good job when he was sacked, and his replacement really hasn't improved things.

Getting shot of a manager at this point is particularly baffling.


It's very easy to sit here but you're not the guy signing his pay cheque at the end of the week.

Football managers know the score and when they are sacked they get paid off so it's not like they're all victims and there were Southampton fans calling for Adkins to go which to me is ridiculous if fans were more patient owners might do the same. I don't think this owner wanted McDermott he has money to spend and he probably wanted to bring in a bigger name who can attract bigger players but having got promotion 1 season quicker than he anticipated he couldn't really sack a manager who was popular with everyone.

You can say not a lot has changed at Southampton but since the new guy took over they've hammered City & Liverpool at home, drawn with Everton and out played Utd at Old Trafford but lost. I'm not saying Adkins deserved to lose his job it's a real shame that another English manager has been replaced by a foreign manager with limited exprience but thats just modern football.

There is no proven formula that says sticking with a manager brings success Chelsea go through managers at a rate of almost 2 per season they've won as many trophies as Utd since Roman took over and we've had 1 manager.

Reading are a very well run club what is vital is that the owner doesn't bring in his own people who will rip the guts of the club out just like the owners at Blackburn have done.

I really hope McDermott gets picked up by another club and is given the chance to build something I think he did a great job at Reading he had a bit of cash in the Championship but after losing the playoff final in his first season to go up as Champions the next year is fantastic. I just think he was maybe a little naive at the start of the season in terms of playing style they shouldn't have been so open as they weren't good enough to trade blows with prem sides and as a result they let in a stupid amount of goals.


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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 12:24 pm 
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JSP wrote:
It's very easy to sit here but you're not the guy signing his pay cheque at the end of the week.

Football managers know the score and when they are sacked they get paid off so it's not like they're all victims and there were Southampton fans calling for Adkins to go which to me is ridiculous if fans were more patient owners might do the same. I don't think this owner wanted McDermott he has money to spend and he probably wanted to bring in a bigger name who can attract bigger players but having got promotion 1 season quicker than he anticipated he couldn't really sack a manager who was popular with everyone.

You can say not a lot has changed at Southampton but since the new guy took over they've hammered City & Liverpool at home, drawn with Everton and out played Utd at Old Trafford but lost. I'm not saying Adkins deserved to lose his job it's a real shame that another English manager has been replaced by a foreign manager with limited exprience but thats just modern football.

There is no proven formula that says sticking with a manager brings success Chelsea go through managers at a rate of almost 2 per season they've won as many trophies as Utd since Roman took over and we've had 1 manager.

Reading are a very well run club what is vital is that the owner doesn't bring in his own people who will rip the guts of the club out just like the owners at Blackburn have done.

I really hope McDermott gets picked up by another club and is given the chance to build something I think he did a great job at Reading he had a bit of cash in the Championship but after losing the playoff final in his first season to go up as Champions the next year is fantastic. I just think he was maybe a little naive at the start of the season in terms of playing style they shouldn't have been so open as they weren't good enough to trade blows with prem sides and as a result they let in a stupid amount of goals.


You're right, I'm not. I'd like to think that if I were then I'd be a bit more realistic. With the squad they have Jose Mourinho wouldn't have kept Reading in the Premier League, so let McDermott carry on with what he's started. They'll have the parachute money next season and can build a team that's capable of getting to and staying in the Premier League.

In a lot of cases a new manager comes in and wants to impart his own style on things. This is something that Swansea have done brilliantly, they have a club mentality and only bring in managers who want to work that way, so each new manager tweaks the system and looks to improve it. In most cases you get a totally different guy in and he'll say "right, we play this way now" and that means they need a load of new players.

Southampton have put in some great performances, but results haven't all gone that well, and when you sit down at the end of the season thinking "we played well there, but lost" doesn't help... a loss is a loss. The results have not significantly improved for Southampton since they changed manager.

Chelsea is an odd one, but if you look at the squad, the signings, etc it's never been the most challenging to get them to win trophies. Avram Grant got them to the Champions League final, and has proven elsewhere that he's a bit rubbish. All Di Matteo did was to put the big names back in the team and let them get on with it, the sight of John Terry shouting instructions from the touchline while Di Matteo sat quietly told you everything you needed to know about where the power was.

McDermott maybe was naive, he tried to stick to his principles, and it didn't work. I hope they show more patience with Adkins.

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idontfeardeath wrote:
Spawny wrote:
But James and Pak both said they were voting JSP


:doh:

You know what Paks like. He's probably voted JSP for woman of the year or something.


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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 12:30 pm 
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Spawny wrote:
You're right, I'm not. I'd like to think that if I were then I'd be a bit more realistic. With the squad they have Jose Mourinho wouldn't have kept Reading in the Premier League, so let McDermott carry on with what he's started. They'll have the parachute money next season and can build a team that's capable of getting to and staying in the Premier League.

In a lot of cases a new manager comes in and wants to impart his own style on things. This is something that Swansea have done brilliantly, they have a club mentality and only bring in managers who want to work that way, so each new manager tweaks the system and looks to improve it. In most cases you get a totally different guy in and he'll say "right, we play this way now" and that means they need a load of new players.


I have to disagree with Jose Mourinho in charge they would have stayed up it wouldn't have been pretty but he is probably the best in game manager going in terms of making changes that win points the quality at the bottom is pretty poor. Jose would have done it ugly but imo he would be able to keep that Reading side up he is worth points in a season and that is why he earns the big bucks.

Adkins Southampton play a fairly similar style to Reading though both clubs have built up through buying well within the football league although Reading don't have the academy that Southampton do to back it up. I totally agree about the poor managerial choices made by some clubs where they go from a passing manager to a route one guy who then needs to change 10 players in the transfer window that is p*ss poor management from your chairman or director of football. In Adkins I think they've appointed someone who fits them perfectly.


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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 12:45 pm 
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JSP wrote:
I have to disagree with Jose Mourinho in charge they would have stayed up it wouldn't have been pretty but he is probably the best in game manager going in terms of making changes that win points the quality at the bottom is pretty poor. Jose would have done it ugly but imo he would be able to keep that Reading side up he is worth points in a season and that is why he earns the big bucks.

Adkins Southampton play a fairly similar style to Reading though both clubs have built up through buying well within the football league although Reading don't have the academy that Southampton do to back it up. I totally agree about the poor managerial choices made by some clubs where they go from a passing manager to a route one guy who then needs to change 10 players in the transfer window that is p*ss poor management from your chairman or director of football. In Adkins I think they've appointed someone who fits them perfectly.


McDermott made game changing switches... usually sticking Le Fondre on for 10 minutes :lol: I don't think Mourinho would have kept them up, I don't think that squad is anywhere near good enough. The only time Jose has over achieved with a team IMO is Porto. You could make an argument for Inter, but they had a pretty damn good squad.

Maybe, we'll have to see whether Adkins can get more out of those players than McDermott did. It'll be tough, keeping in mind that some of those may well look to leave in the summer when they go down.

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idontfeardeath wrote:
Spawny wrote:
But James and Pak both said they were voting JSP


:doh:

You know what Paks like. He's probably voted JSP for woman of the year or something.


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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 1:15 pm 
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Spawny wrote:
McDermott made game changing switches... usually sticking Le Fondre on for 10 minutes :lol: I don't think Mourinho would have kept them up, I don't think that squad is anywhere near good enough. The only time Jose has over achieved with a team IMO is Porto. You could make an argument for Inter, but they had a pretty damn good squad.

Maybe, we'll have to see whether Adkins can get more out of those players than McDermott did. It'll be tough, keeping in mind that some of those may well look to leave in the summer when they go down.


I think that's incredibly harsh on Jose his Chelsea side went from second place behind the invicibles and absolutely bossed the EPL for two seasons didn't they break the highest points total in his second season? They made the Champions League semi final but were knocked out by Liverpool thanks to the infamous "ghost goal."

As for Inter yes the league titles are a little bit tainted by the fact that there was no competition but you can't knock the fact he won the European Cup beating Chelsea, Barcelona and Bayern Munich on the way.

At Madrid in his second season they set a new record in La Liga and made the semi finals of the Champions League going out on penalties to Bayern and this season they look likely to make the semi finals again. This is a club who before he arrived hadn't been past the 1st knockout round in something like 10 years and he now regularly gets the better of Barcelona in the Classico's when he turned up he got pumped 5-0 in his first one also he made Pep's life so difficult that he had to quit as Barca manager.

I'm not saying he hasn't been helped by being able to assemble superstar squads at his last 3 clubs but he still delivers the trophies better than any other manager in world football. You only have to look at how he changed that game at Old Trafford after the sending off to see how good a manager he is I think at Reading they would have picked up way more points at the start of the season with a manager like Jose in charge just by being difficult to beat.

Looking at the Reading squad how many of them will get a move to a Prem side off the back of this season? I can see maybe one or two like McAnuff getting picked up by a Norwich or Villa and I can't see Pogrebnyak playing in the Championship but I don't see a Prem side coming in for him.


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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 1:33 pm 
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JSP wrote:
They made the Champions League semi final but were knocked out by Liverpool thanks to the infamous "ghost goal.".


The same goal that if it wasn't a goal then it was a sending off and a penalty?

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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 2:11 pm 
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idontfeardeath wrote:
JSP wrote:
They made the Champions League semi final but were knocked out by Liverpool thanks to the infamous "ghost goal.".


The same goal that if it wasn't a goal then it was a sending off and a penalty?


There is no guarentee that the ref (unless he said afterwards) would have awarded a penalty and red card as Luis Garcia had a shot at goal without a keeper which he couldn't take which is a pretty clear advantage so if they had seen the ball didn't cross the line he could have allowed the game to play on.

Even if it was worst case a penalty and red card that would have changed the whole outcome of the game and there is nothing to say Chelsea wouldn't have won or drawn which would have seen them through.

That said reaching a semi final in his first season at Chelsea shouldn't really be judged as failure the following season when they went out to Barcelona and in 2007 didn't Liverpool beat them on pens?

Basically I stand by my comment if Mourinho was in charge of Reading for the whole season they probably wouldn't get relegated.

If SAF was in charge of Man City or Chelsea they probably would have won the league this season good managers get teams to punch above their weight and win by getting players to go that extra yard for their team mates regardless of quality.


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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 2:25 pm 
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JSP wrote:
I think that's incredibly harsh on Jose his Chelsea side went from second place behind the invicibles and absolutely bossed the EPL for two seasons didn't they break the highest points total in his second season? They made the Champions League semi final but were knocked out by Liverpool thanks to the infamous "ghost goal."

As for Inter yes the league titles are a little bit tainted by the fact that there was no competition but you can't knock the fact he won the European Cup beating Chelsea, Barcelona and Bayern Munich on the way.

At Madrid in his second season they set a new record in La Liga and made the semi finals of the Champions League going out on penalties to Bayern and this season they look likely to make the semi finals again. This is a club who before he arrived hadn't been past the 1st knockout round in something like 10 years and he now regularly gets the better of Barcelona in the Classico's when he turned up he got pumped 5-0 in his first one also he made Pep's life so difficult that he had to quit as Barca manager.

I'm not saying he hasn't been helped by being able to assemble superstar squads at his last 3 clubs but he still delivers the trophies better than any other manager in world football. You only have to look at how he changed that game at Old Trafford after the sending off to see how good a manager he is I think at Reading they would have picked up way more points at the start of the season with a manager like Jose in charge just by being difficult to beat.

Looking at the Reading squad how many of them will get a move to a Prem side off the back of this season? I can see maybe one or two like McAnuff getting picked up by a Norwich or Villa and I can't see Pogrebnyak playing in the Championship but I don't see a Prem side coming in for him.


I don't think it's harsh at all. I don't class what he did at Chelsea, Inter, or Madrid as over achieving given the resources available to him. Porto winning the Champions League was a special achievement, that was the best thing he's done in his career to date. I'm not saying that he hasn't achieved great things, because clearly he has, but to win the league as Real Madrid boss is pretty much a minimum requirement. If he'd won the league with Deportivo then you'd say he'd over achieved.

I think that you think I'm saying he's not a top drawer manager, and that's not what I'm saying. In fact the fact that I've used him as my example should show that I rate him very highly indeed.

McAnuff will probably go, Pogrebnyak will probably clear off back to Russia. I can see some of the lower / newly promoted teams looking at players like Kebe, Robson-Kanu, Guthrie, Le Fondre... just to get a bit of Premier League experience in the squad.

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idontfeardeath wrote:
Spawny wrote:
But James and Pak both said they were voting JSP


:doh:

You know what Paks like. He's probably voted JSP for woman of the year or something.


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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 2:39 pm 
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Maybe a few might stay in the Prem but I can't see promoted clubs buying from relegated clubs the best way now seems to be to buy players from the championship to bring up with you.

West Ham got stung for Matt Jarvis £9m for a player who was part of a team who got relegated seems like a ridiculous sum of money now


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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 2:56 pm 
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Jarvis was on the back of a pretty good season, and he's not a bad player. For sure West Ham overpaid though.

I just think that if someone can pick up a Guthrie or Robson-Kanu for a couple of million then they will. Especially if Watford go up as most of their squad are loan players :lol:

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idontfeardeath wrote:
Spawny wrote:
But James and Pak both said they were voting JSP


:doh:

You know what Paks like. He's probably voted JSP for woman of the year or something.


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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 3:15 pm 
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Spawny wrote:
Jarvis was on the back of a pretty good season, and he's not a bad player. For sure West Ham overpaid though.

I just think that if someone can pick up a Guthrie or Robson-Kanu for a couple of million then they will. Especially if Watford go up as most of their squad are loan players :lol:


Was it a good season I seem to remember the season before he looked decent but his last season wasn't as impressive I couldn't believe West Ham paid £9m for him.

The problem will be that Reading will be asking for decent money for these players as they're the sort of players they'll want to build there promotion push around.

Will be intersting to see what loop-hole Watford find for next season in the Prem I can see them transferring a lot of the players from Udinese to Watford as permanent deals with re-sale clauses should they want to take them back. Basically sell Vydra to Watford for £5m with a buy back price of £5m if he turns good you take him back if he's sh*t that's £5m of EPL TV money that Udinese has taken out of Watford for 0 risk.


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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 3:19 pm 
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Udinese and Watford are owned by the same person?

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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 3:20 pm 
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JSP wrote:
Was it a good season I seem to remember the season before he looked decent but his last season wasn't as impressive I couldn't believe West Ham paid £9m for him.

The problem will be that Reading will be asking for decent money for these players as they're the sort of players they'll want to build there promotion push around.

Will be intersting to see what loop-hole Watford find for next season in the Prem I can see them transferring a lot of the players from Udinese to Watford as permanent deals with re-sale clauses should they want to take them back. Basically sell Vydra to Watford for £5m with a buy back price of £5m if he turns good you take him back if he's sh*t that's £5m of EPL TV money that Udinese has taken out of Watford for 0 risk.


Maybe it was the year before then, I forget. I know he had a decent season at some point :lol: £9m was a ludicrous amount for him, but Sam needed someone to put the ball on Carroll's head.

True, although Guthrie never seemed to get that much of a chance this season.

There's bound to be something that they'll do, it's ridiculous to have that many loan players at the club, if they were all to leave then there's no way that club would survive in the top flight. Same people own a Spanish club too don't they?

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idontfeardeath wrote:
Spawny wrote:
But James and Pak both said they were voting JSP


:doh:

You know what Paks like. He's probably voted JSP for woman of the year or something.


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 Post subject: Re: The Reading Room
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 3:21 pm 
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idontfeardeath wrote:
Udinese and Watford are owned by the same person?


Yes, and I think they own a Spanish club too.

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idontfeardeath wrote:
Spawny wrote:
But James and Pak both said they were voting JSP


:doh:

You know what Paks like. He's probably voted JSP for woman of the year or something.


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